The price of Engine Oil

[Styria]

To be perfectly honest, I have always bought my oil from K - Mart or Big W, except for many years ago when I used to deal with Castrol direct. That contact is all gone now, so the Supermarkets it is.....or, of course, from Repco at various times.

Now, Repco have always maintained that "there is no profit margin in oil" so any discount you'd get would always be miniscule. In fact, Supermarkets were, as a rule, the cheaper alternative if comparing like with like. What I have noticed lately is the considerable jump in oil prices being charged by the larger outlets, such as Repco, Supercheap Auto and the retail giants - it looks like the "Rudd" factor has found its way into the Automotive World as well. Castrol Magnetite is now approaching the $40.00 mark for five litres, especially at a fairly new outlet by the name of Burson Automotives. The Supermarkets are still a little cheaper, but not by much. So guys, we're on a roller coaster ride - sorry, not downhill, but in the other direction. Just look around yourself a bit. Regards Styria

 

[BenzBoy]

So you see some price fixing? Well the ACCC has accused the oil companies of consorting but not yet of price fixing. Maybe that will come.
My main concern with oil is NOT the price but the performance it offers and the approvals it gains from manufactureres - a cheap oil that is substandard is not worth using even if it free.
Regards,
Benz-Boy

 

[WGB]

So guys, we're on a roller coaster ride - sorry, not downhill, but in the other direction. Just look around yourself a bit. Regards Styria

The West Coast of Australia did not vote for Mr Rudd - well at least I didn't - and not many around here own up to it.

The night they got in I said to my wife that it's going to take 10 years to pay the bills these clowns spend.

I didn't know that they would take less than a year to rack up a generation's worth of debt.

And anyway - isn't our "real" PM Julia Gillard. Mr K.Rudd is never in the country.


Bill (Just applying lotion to my red neck)

 

[Styria]

So you see some price fixing? Well the ACCC has accused the oil companies of consorting but not yet of price fixing. Maybe that will come.
My main concern with oil is NOT the price but the performance it offers and the approvals it gains from manufactureres - a cheap oil that is substandard is not worth using even if it free.
Regards,
Benz-Boy

Hi BenzBoy, I am not in a position to determine if price fixing is the order of the day. What I do know is that the big companies have their 'snouts in the trough' - up to the eye balls, if not higher. Went to Big W the other day to check on price of Christmas cards - there was one card that I quite liked - you know, it wasn't too fancy, but really quite nice - I do like a nice card, especially for someone somewhat special. I turned this particular card 'upside down' so to speak which revealed the country of manufacture - no. not Germany, but made in China. The price - a cool 11 bucks. I think the Australian public is really getting slaughtered by greed and we are copping it. Thank God for places like "GO LOW" or the "Reject Shop".

Hell, getting back to price of oil and quality thereof - just how little is it that we know ? You know my sentiments - pay nore, and get better - have I got this wright or am I blowing into a paper bag with a hole in it ? I dunno. Regards Styria (It wouldn't be the first time ). Regards Styria

 

[BenzBoy]

Well Styria - that is the friendly, family face of capitalism for you. Love it or not it has served us rather well and no-one makes us buy things we don't want. I don't send Christmas cards - I do write a short note on fine linen paper that I buy from my favourite paper shop La Plume in Paris so I stock up when I go. Oils? Well now, all I can suggest is reading the data sheets that are supplied by the companies and seeing if what you want is what you are getting. It reminds me of the story told by the Shell rep very recently - "Yes, we do make petrol with ethanol in it and we do make cheaper oils for mass markets but I don't use either and that is all I can say". Draw your own conclusion from that. I can't advise if they have their snouts in the trough but it would seem like a good place to put a snout if one had a snout and a trough.....
I could illustrate with a demand and supply curve but possibly not on here.
Regards,
Benz-Boy

 

[oscar]

I reach to the top shelf at Supercheap for Castrol Edge to use in POVO and the 350 and try and turn away so I don't catch a glimpse of the price. I can't say if it's risen or not but I do murmur "S#!T" knowing it's around the $60/5L mark and I buy 2 bottles every time I race. But it's worth it.

I use 20w-60 in both cars and there's very little smoke plus no fouling of plugs in the 350. The 280 just spends it's time running at high revs so never seems to foul even though oil is consumed. If I put a similarly weighted semi synth or non synth in, both engines smoke.

If prices are rising and do so dramatically, I might have a rethink and make a change because I've nothing against frequent castrol GTX changes for example, but I'd prefer not to change at the moment. My loose engines seem to work best with this Edge stuff and although expensive, is cheaper than rebuilds which I admit, are ultimately waiting.

 

[BenzBoy]

Um...the oil for the Spirit is Penrite Syn which arrives at a total of $160 for the oil alone. The oil for the PII is Penrite Classic at $200 per fill. The ML and the CLK run on Mobil 1 0-40 and who knows what that costs - it's all hidden in the service charges anyway.
Regards,
Bnez-Boy

 

[SELfor50]

I reach to the top shelf at Supercheap for Castrol Edge to use in POVO and the 350 and try and turn away so I don't catch a glimpse of the price. I can't say if it's risen or not but I do murmur "S#!T" knowing it's around the $60/5L mark and I buy 2 bottles every time I race. But it's worth it.

I use 20w-60 in both cars and there's very little smoke plus no fouling of plugs in the 350. The 280 just spends it's time running at high revs so never seems to foul even though oil is consumed. If I put a similarly weighted semi synth or non synth in, both engines smoke.

If prices are rising and do so dramatically, I might have a rethink and make a change because I've nothing against frequent castrol GTX changes for example, but I'd prefer not to change at the moment. My loose engines seem to work best with this Edge stuff and although expensive, is cheaper than rebuilds which I admit, are ultimately waiting.

A well timed thread for me... is the Castrol Edge fully Synthetic Oscar??
I'd like to begin using Synthetic from the start with the new engine for the 690. A little scared with that meaning an oil change will cost me $150 or so for the Oil alone.

Is there any other Synthetic oils someone can recommend for an M100 6.9 engine? Eg, performance vs price.

 

[TJ 450]

My personal preference is Mobil 1 15w-50 or 5w-50.

I would say that synthetic is a must, with that engine.

Tim

 

[John S]

A new M100 engine, I would use the Mobil 1 15-50 as it's not made to the same tolerances or of the same materials as the new Mercedes engines - eg you have the 'standard' piston rings, not the low tension type used now.

 

[Michel]

As one famous gangster once said:

Oils aint oils

and

Soils aint soils

 

[BenzBoy]

I would certainly support the use of only fully synthetic and given the tolerances I would not go down as low as 0-40 or even 5-50. I would support John's statement about using something like 15-50.
And as you know, Castrol (Wakefield) is now owned by Shell....
Regards,
Benz-Boy

 

[SELfor50]

The workshop has Valvoline Semi-Synth 15-50.

Other than that I can head over to supercheap and get something different..

I want to go valvoline, purely for the fact that john laws uses it.

 

[BenzBoy]

Semi-synth is a good oil but it is NOT a patch on fully synthetic. I went to a Shell seminar on oils recently and although I can't tell you all the science I came away convinced that in a new or rebuilt motor fully synthetic is a must. I also came away convinced that one should use a fully synthetic of appropriate weight in an older motor.
Why don't you contact Penrite and see if they will sponsor you by providing oil? You may well find you are in luck.
Regards,
Benz-Boy

 

[Michel]

The workshop has Valvoline Semi-Synth 15-50.
I want to go valvoline, purely for the fact that john laws uses it.

 

[SELfor50]

Semi-synth is a good oil but it is NOT a patch on fully synthetic. I went to a Shell seminar on oils recently and although I can't tell you all the science I came away convinced that in a new or rebuilt motor fully synthetic is a must. I also came away convinced that one should use a fully synthetic of appropriate weight in an older motor.
Why don't you contact Penrite and see if they will sponsor you by providing oil? You may well find you are in luck.
Regards,
Benz-Boy

Understand completely. The plan is to run the semi-synth for the first 5-10000km's.. just to sorta run it in. The engine is run in already, but it'll make me feel comfortable.

But you're also spot on with the weight. I've been advised not to run anything under 15-50 in the motor. So, now I need to find a fully synthetic 15-50. Penrite sponsorship?? Guess it wouldn't hurt to give it a go. I guess it means they're confident in their product if they were keen.

Is that something you do for the Phantom?? Have you had that re-built?


Michel, love the vid. HAha... Valvoline, you KNOW what I mean.. hahahah.... golden tonsils ay.

 

[BenzBoy]

Why use a semi-synth to run it in? Is there a reason?
No: the PII is not yet rebuilt but the new head has been ordered. The price? Don't ask...
Regards,
Benz-Boy

 

[oscar]

A well timed thread for me... is the Castrol Edge fully Synthetic Oscar??

Castrol Edge Sport is. That's what I meant. There is a 25w-50 Castrol Edge I think that's a semi synth. I bought that to try once not realising it was semi synth but I use Edge Sport now 10w-60 (correction from earlier post I said 20w-60 I meant 10w-60).

Um...the oil for the Spirit is Penrite Syn which arrives at a total of $160 for the oil alone. The oil for the PII is Penrite Classic at $200 per fill. The ML and the CLK run on Mobil 1 0-40 and who knows what that costs - it's all hidden in the service charges anyway.
Regards,
Bnez-Boy

Completely forgot about Mobil1 and didn't realise Penrite had a full synth. My local superchic and other outlets don't sell it and noone used to stock any grade of Mobil1 higher than 5w-50 which was too thin for my loose engine.

Cam good luck in choosing. I'd say go full synth but choose a brand and stick to it. It'd would be intersting to get the oil analysed after say the first 1000 and the next 2 or 3 then other services. No idea how much it would cost but ages ago when I was on FordForums there was a guy doing that with his new Terri Ghia and the results were amazing, I thought. Basically a new engine, although machined to fine tolerances will have minor highs and troughs between contact surfaces which wear away as parts move and develop wear patterns. The first oil change showed high levels of tin, iron, zinc and I can't remember what else. Those levels dramatically decrease after the "running in" period and the engine frees up a little. Fuel consumption also improves but I'm not going to ask you for real fuel consumption figures because I know it wouldn't be possible to limit wheel slip but it'd be interesting to see if similar oil test results occured with this new m100.

 

[Styria]

I have a slightly different view to most of you, based on experience rather than scientific knowledge. I think any engine, whether it's been fully reconditioned, or has had just a valve grind and de-coke, greatly benefits from 'running in' or settling down of components running - in fact, even with a head removal job only, it takes about five thousand kilometers for components to settle down.

Thus, in that period, I am happy to use the cheaper type of oil, but change it least every thousand or so kilometers, and that should include the filter as well - at least, for the first two or three changes. After that, by all means, use a good quality oil, probably about 20/50 grade. In another post, I have referred to the prioce of oil having increased considerably - when you ask for a trade discount, the most common 'stock answer' is "there is hardly any margin in oils' - yeah, right.

Gleaming Beauty has done about 370K., blows no smoke, does not rattle, oil pressure is certainly better than marginal, and I am convinced that I am getting the benefit of frequent oil changes during the last twelve months, using 'cheapish' type of oil. I am about to change to 20/50 Nulon - for older engines. Don't know why - perhaps because of price, but I have also found an outlet (not Supermarkets nor Supercheap) that's actually prepared to give you a discount - but they don't stock Castrol. My two bobs' worth. Regards Styria

 

[TJ 450]

I am about to start using Mobil Super 2000 x2 10W-40 in my 6.9. It is a semi-synthetic.

10W-50 would be even better.

The owner's manual tells you everything you need to know about appropriate viscosity. It is best to go with an oil with the wider range so that it flows quickly at startup, but maintains the higher viscosity when warm IMHO.

Tim