Winton April 6, 2008

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B13

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Here are some pictures I to today of SELfor50 racing 450SEL at Winton today:

Morning preparation:

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Scruitineering bay: yes they are Yokohama A032R tyres and parked next to Cam is a brick... Austin Cooper S

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Smile on Cam's dial indicates all is good for the scrutineering - lets race!

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Gridded up and ready to go!!

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This isn't a great shot but I've put it because it shows an ex-Bathurst GTHO Phase 3, a HQ series racecar, and a Cam:

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Pedal to the metal after the esses onto the front straight:

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I.
 

Mercules

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Go Cam Go! :) :) :)

Looks like you guys had an awesome day! What was your best lap time Cam? I love those cold air ducts under the headlights... hardcore brutha! Did the A032R's make much of a difference? The topklasse stickers must have been good for at least -0.5 second each lap... they are trick! Thanks for flying the flag Cam! :cool:

Did you have a spin Ian?

Is that a Corolla in front of the Mini?

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B13

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Cam did 3 heats and I did 4 heats. By the time we called it a day results were up only for the 1st two heats and Cam had gone from an average 2:01.?? to a best of 2:00.39

I'd been hovering around 1:48 and got that down to a low 1:47 in a worked Mazda RX4.

In general with Winton, a rookie in a stanard-class we consider any time under 2 minutes to be a good effort. I have no doubt that in the 3rd heat Cam run in he might have got a smidge under 2:00 and I might have even made it to high 1:46s as the RX4 was running really well...

Some notes for the day:

Using a Pyrometer (sp?) the brake disc temp after the cool down lap was still F: 415C R: ~300C indicating an on track working temp probably up around F:500-550C R: ~400C.

The A032Rs did a sterling job but their wear rate was incredible, you could see the difference, mm by mm lower, in between heats. But they did hang in there, even when one of the rear tyres was starting to shread (developed a flat spot and then a hole in the outer layer rubber) Cam was still able to complete the 3rd heat with them. Trivia: did you notice in the picture of the W116 next to the mini they both have the same A032Rs? Mini has tiny 165/50-10s, while Cam's has giant 225/60-15s.

We ran out of words to describe how lousey the 3.07 single spinner diff was. Most of the rear tyre wear was probably due to wheelspin coming out of corners from the massive 368nM M117 torques.

After the 1st heat when Cam returned off the track the front brakes were smoking! The ATE pads used were rated at 550C and I reckon it was probably running at the limits of their design. As a buffer zone Cam will look into fitting a race-style pad material rated 750C or more. With all credit to ATE, they did not fade noticably, they just got bloody hot and smoked... and smelled.

For the 1st time since Cam has owned the car the engine got hot enough for it to switch on the aux fan, at an indicated 110C on the temp gauge.

You probably notice a bit of a bit of a textured finish on the headlight covers... thats dead bugs underneath from the long drive from Cbr - Win .. we left them there to assist with quick removal of the headlight covers at the end of the day.

I didn't run in the car but am all enthused to get my 450SE track ready...

The car in front of the mini on the starting grid is a Camry... laugh it up but the driver is very talented and with a few ECU and tyre and brake mods its seriously much faster than a Camry should be... mid 1:40s ....

The check list for cam before the next Sprint is long:

Check brake discs for cracks
Fix leaking master cyl O-ring
Change brake pads for Race pads
Procure more A032Rs
Lower the car about a foot
Fit an LSD with a more useful ratio than 3.07:1
Install Pleather of death
Needs more of an exhaust note, so maybe a sidepipe exiting under the rear door

Sometime soon there should be some youtube clips uploaded, including one with Cam being interviewed before the 3rd heat.

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Michel

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Very impressive guys.:D

Everytime I read your stories on the track, that little voice in me comes back saying "go on... get back into it..."

Ahhh.... if only I had the time... :rolleyes:

Keep it up guys.
I am (we are) proud of you :D
 

SELfor50

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The stickers definately got me -5.0secs a lap!! ;)

The day was best fun i've almost ever had!!

Ian had a couple really good stints in the RX4.. The standout was against an SS commonwhore (VX i think) that had Gen 3, 6.0L v8. 6 Speed auto. And Mav's was trailing him and getting closer the whole sprint. I'll get some vids up of that later..

My checklist before the next event, is quite long - but will definately be completed.
The car held up extremely well, and as Mav's said. It's the first time i've ever heard that AUX fan come on.. So good to know it's doing it's job.

Before next event there will be:

1. New rotors (drilled / vented) plus hopefully some sort of ducting down to the discs for cold air
2. New springs / shocks (all custom and much lower / firmer)
3. New diff (as talked about 3.46:1 LSD from 350SLC)
4. New Competition pads' (same as Ian's hunted down)
5. Fixed o-ring on master cylinder (not too bad, but has to be done)
6. More tyres (picking them up on 19th of april, or the 29th or the 12th at either 1200, 1900 or 2900 hrs.. don't ask!)
7. Pleather of death installed.
8. exhaust chopped at 1st muffler - stuck out the side.

I won't be competing at any events for at least 3-4months so i can get all this done.

Just wanna say a big thanks to Ian, he's extremely experienced with all this, and it's a MASSIVE help!!!

I'll be posting vids / pics of the day in the coming weeks.. technical difficulties.. :(


--== MICHEL ==--
YOU KNOW YOU WANNA RACE, GO BUY THAT 380SE WITH 5.0L 117 ENGINE AND JOIN THE TEAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

Michel

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--== MICHEL ==--
YOU KNOW YOU WANNA RACE, GO BUY THAT 380SE WITH 5.0L 117 ENGINE AND JOIN THE TEAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What 380SE with a 5Litre engine?
 

Michel

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Thanks for the link.:)

But boys..... seriously, if I were to be involved, it would have to be with something a little more competitive than a W126 380 with a 500 engine... :rolleyes:

Plus, where is my allegiance to the Forum? :confused:

I would have to start with at least a 116.... :p

And then it would have to be seriously boosted mechanically :D
 
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B13

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it would have to be with something a little more competitive than a W126 380 with a 500 engine

Was wondering how long before you uttered that one... LOL

Designed to keep you firmly in my rear vision mirrors...

:)
 

SELfor50

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Thanks for the link.:)



And then it would have to be seriously boosted mechanically :D

Literally?? Like how many pound boost? :D


Gotta start somewhere mate, how bout the 690SEL you'd be really competitive then. People would run off the road cause of the blinding RED! :D ;)
 

Michel

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Literally?? Like how many pound boost? :D


Gotta start somewhere mate, how bout the 690SEL you'd be really competitive then. People would run off the road cause of the blinding RED! :D ;)

The 690SEL would be very competitive and would handle beautifully.....

But I would not take a rare car like this and get it thrashed (cos i want to have fun too :D )

A good 450SE would have to be the starting point...
Or... even a hot 280SE....

Enough power add ons... (NOS, TURBOCHARGER, SUPERCHARGER, ETC....)
should keep everyone in the rear view mirror.... :p
 

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SELfor50, B13, you mentioned fitting an LSD,

have you given it much thought as to what you would fit?

ford 9"? LSD from another w116? maybe from a 6.9 if you could find one?

I'd imagine for that short track you would need a taller diff, 4:11?
How fast can you get up to on that track, or I guess the more appropiate question is what is the longest stretch of straight track?


interesting to see the progress,

SELfor50; have you given much thought to shedding some weight off the car?
 
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B13

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My (yet to be fitted) LSD has been procured from a 350SL which didn't need it anymore... ratio is 3.46:1 and as best as I can tell it will fit with minimal (if any) modifications...

If we work on a max engine speed of 6500 rpm, if we go much lower than that we're likely to run out of legs on the longer grand-prix type circuits like Sandown and Philip Island.

I know that 200km/h in 4th gear (1:1) on my RX4 requires 10,000rpm using a 4.4:1 diff. (I have an overdrive 5th in that car but since top gear in the 116 is 1:1 there's no sence in having a discussion about overdrive 5ths).

The 280 diff would be great for a short curcuit like sutton on winton if there was any way to get all that power and torques to the ground...

Cam and I are both going to try the 350SL diff in our respective cars and make notes from there. The RX4 runs a locker (welded) but doesn't have a lot of weight over the rear of the car so basically lives and works OK under that car , as Cam can testify.

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SELfor50

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Ian's setup in the RX4 definately looks / sounds / IS the goods!

I'm extremely confident the 350SLC diff will be a good compromise between acceleration and 'legs' for the 3 speed. The LSD is a must for the track... can't wait to get it in.

As for weight reduction, it's already begun. Along with stripping the interior, all the electric window motors / sunroof motor (possibly sunroof too, replacing with perspex if regulations permit), all air con / heating equipment, plumbing etc..
Easiest way to say it is - it'll only be a bucket seat, the motor and what's needed to get it round the track will remain in the car. Anything and everything not needed will be gutted...takes time though.


Longest stretch of the track, not sure. I didn't touch 3rd gear the whole track. Max speed was about 140km/h. Doesn't sound very fast, but like I said, didn't touch 3rd gear. 140 was redlining in 2nd when i had to brake.
3.46:1 diff will get me where i need to go i think.

Cam.
 
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B13

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My preference is for "full spool" diff centre - basically a locked diff with no differential ability at any speed. Trouble is they are hard to find for Mazdas and impossible to find for MBs. As an alternative we weld up the diff centre of a Mazda diff (called a CIG locker) so make a locked diff. There's no reason this couldn't be employed in a MB diff.

Low speed drivability becomes terrible, as Cam saw on the weekend manouvering the RX4 in tight places required decent prods on the accelerator to brake traction on whichever wheel is on the inside.

On the plus side thru the sweeper and esses I can keep the boot in thru left and right transitions without any worry that the inside wheel will start spinning. I think its fair to say that Cam had to work much harder than I did at these parts of the track as at various times I could hear the torque getting the better of the 450SEL and lighting up whichever rear wheel was on the inside.

Locker diffs require very strong axles, driveshafts and universals due to the incredible demands on them. And this is even moreso the heavier the car.
 

SELfor50

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I agree, a locker would be ideal!!

I don't have any level of confidence that I wouldn't be snapping axle's though.
With the weight of the ol' girl - I reckon it would be 1-2 events before the shalfts would be used toothpicks.

I'm guessing upgraded / lowered / firmed suspension would put a lot less strain on the shafts / axles of a locker though, yeah?? :confused:
 

SELfor50

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RESULTS from Winton April 6, 2008

Results are up!!

http://www.ffcc.asn.au/results.htm

Click on the top link FFCC vs HSCCV Round 1 (Winton) 2008.

You'll have to enlarge to about 200%. Out of 50 Car's I came 43rd.
Ian's RX4 was 20 places ahead in 23rd (just ahead of the GTHO Phase 3) nice work Mavric!! ;)

My best 3 runs were during my 3rd run of the day.. I know I could've squeezed an extra second or 2 out of the track had I gone for another 2 sprints...though I wanted the ol' girl to get me back to Canberra.. :)
Being the only 'Mercedes' on the list, and also topping a few purpose built track cars (The mini, HQ, Capri etc) i'm pretty stoked! :D

It's only up from here! :cool:

Cam2. :)
 

Michel

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We're all proud of you Cam....

Keep it up :D
 
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