Question on lights on race cars

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Des

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Guys, I thought as we have a few people here who are into racing they might know the answer to this.

What is the purpose of blacking out the headlights like this on a car?

mbgalerie_6980697_24.png

I have seen it done all over the place on different race cars,

Is it to stop the glass getting broken and stuck in the tyres?

Would seem strange on this car as they have bolted up extra lights.
 

B13

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The FIA (and so by association CAMS) says that only forward facing glass allowed is the windscreen.

Since indicators are plastic, in most cars you just need to cover the headlights.

Rally cars with additional lighting have plastic covers over those lights... that red AMG 6.3 has them on the Cibie Oscar lights (below the bonnet strap) and by rights should have the lower of the Americana headlights covered as well.

I've never questioned what its all for, because in all honesty, the taped over headlights, to my eye, give cars more track cred anyway.

For those who don't like it, covering your headlights in clear Contact is also acceptable, and many people do just that.

Hope that helps,

Ian.
 

B13

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If interested, this document contains all the things we bear in mind when assembling any car for competition duties:

http://www.camsmanual.com.au/pdf/general/0603_Schedule_A_B_Q308.pdf

Schedule B, item 16 relates to the headlight covers.

But also you can see why we have blue triangles on the car (B/17), leather steering wheels (B/13), dual throttle return springs (B/7), harness (A/11), and in fact be a car (A/1).

I.
 
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Des

Des

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ok thanks yes, have been tossing up the idea of getting into some sort of racing, maybe something similar to what you and Cam are doing,

thanks, food for thought anyway.


Kind Regards
Des
 

oscar

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Do it Des:cool:

As far as the non blacked out lights on the 6.3 above - Assuming they didn't use clear film, I wonder if that rule was relaxed somewhat for the 24hr events, hence why the lower and "spottie" lights were left as is ?? just a theory.
 
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Des

Des

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Do it Des:cool:

Like you I have a car with an M110 in it,

I have been doing a bit of research on what AMG did to these cars and engines,

Firstly found a picture of an AMG 280CE,

strich8coupe-rally.png


and some information on what they did to the M110

AMG started in 67', and offered engine tuning beginning in the mid 70'.
The Daimler Benz "middleclass" Limousine of those days was the W 114/115 called /8, the W 114 was the line with the more powerful engines.
In 67' Daimler Benz offered the W 114 with three old-fashioned carburettor engines, the inline six cylinder types M 180.954 {2.292 cm?}; M 114.920 {2.496 cm?} and M 130.923 {2.778 cm?}.
AMG especially offered engine tuning on the high end, means the M 100/116/117 {V 8 3 ½ - 6.8 Litre} engines.
In Spring 1972 Daimler Benz started the production of the W 114.060/.062 and C 114.042/.073 with the new M 110 2.746 cm? twin cam inline six cylinder engine.

These new inline six cylinder engines, designed like older famous competition engines like Maserati, Jaguar, Osca and Alfa, have had enough potential to be tuned as well.
AMG based their medium sector activity on those new twin cam 2.8 Litre engines and heavily modified the carburettor sohc M 130.
They used the same two types of tuning for the M 110.921 and M 110.981 engines, used Bosch D Jetronic indirect fuel injection on the M 110.921 instead the Solex 4 A 1 carburettor originally mounted.
The "first tuning stage" was to replace the cams by AMG cams and to modify the valve levers.
The ignition point was changed.
The power was increased to 195 hp @ 6.000 rpm.
The "second tuning stage" reflected much more impact on the basic design. Using the "stage one tuning", the cylinder head was removed an the intake manifolds and exhaust passage extended and polished, valves and combustion chambers have been reworked.
The exhaust manifold was replaced and the inlet pipe modified.
Such engines reached 210 hp @ 6.300 rpm, the torque was increased to 250 Nm @ 5.000 rpm.
Later a "stage three tuning" was offered {in my opinion after the W 114 has stopped and the W 123 was offered}, increasing the compression ratio, replacing the exhaust and inlet pipes, using larger valves and valve springs those engines reached >225 hp.
The M 130.923 was tuned equal to the M 110 "stage three tuning". Carburettors have been replaced by the Bosch fuel injection.
These single cam M 130 reached the power of the serial M 110.981 185 hp @ 6.000 U/min.
AMG offered suspension kits and used larger rims on those cars, it was essential to rework the suspension after engine tuning, but those kits have been sold independent from engine tuning. An the other hand the seats sometimes have been replaced by Recaros.
 
B

BAR

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Race or Rally - us the question.

All FIA sanctioned motor sports events fall into one of a multitidue of categories, which in themselves are governed by certain regulations.

The vehicle in the photograph would appear to be prepared for Rally use and not Race. A very important difference.

Depending on the year and event class in which it was being used, again the regulations may vary.

One such regulation covers the number of forward facing 'driving lights', restricting the total number of forward facing units to a maximum of SIX. Thus with the installation of two pairs of additional lights on this car, the vehicle would have had a total of eight: hence the requirement to remove or cover up one of the original pairs in the headlamp assembly of the car.
 

oscar

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Geez Des that ce looks beat up bad. Since AMG have done all the hard yards in the past on what's best mechanically for an M110 it would be great to copy the upgrades somehow. Better still if you could just go and buy the right camshafts but by the sounds of it, they did a hell of a lot more reworking than that. Whilst there'll be AMG decals on my car I'd love to work towards something more authentic when it comes to the powertrain though I think I'll at best only end up with an aesthetic fake. Might even try and replicate the AMG logo that appeared on the rocker cover.

I like your idea on the rally rather than race prepped 6.3 BAR but did these rally at all? I don't know too much about them or have only read about Spa and Nurburgring.

Great footage there too Des. Wonderful sight around some of those banked corners.
 

B13

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Thats what Oscar's Povo will sound like on full song!
 

oscar

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:D I have stumbled across that one before and whilst I too wanted to have the V8 sound and race setup, things like that vid had me convinced that an m110 is worthy for a caneing.

And what about the Carlsson w123. I think Nutz posted this link ages ago but I've seen it a few times now and the still photos on the net if you google for them look awsome. With flared guards and fat tyres and the silver black scheme, it's one serious looking coupe. About halfway through it's all modern footage of the car now, watch it handle the tarmac. Love it.

 
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Des

Des

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The recaro, presumably, seats would also be nice, if you start chucking a car around you roll around in the standard seats.

Also note the really tall manual gear shifter, you see that a lot on race cars, not sure why that is done?
 

oscar

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Des, I just realised where your avatar came from :rolleyes:

To be honest I always thought that engine bay with the amg rocker cover was from a w123. (never noticed words on the photo before, such is the power of the amg logo:D)

I've been checking out a lot of seats on ebay but just can't afford to throw too many $ at povo atm.

That gear stick, I thought it was unusual. I've thought about getting a long cylindrical stick type but the prob is that there's a lot of travel from 1st to 2nd etc that a long stick will make those movements more pronounced and will make the gear changes a lot slower. Don't know if it'd be an issue for an auto but for an auto, it would be cool to have a sort of tiptronic movement from 1st thru to 3rd.
 
B

BAR

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To answer the question as to my rally vehicle no it wasn’t a Mercedes, but it was a Mitsubishi. Never could afford to damage a Merc let alone the development costs of a rally version.

From my faint recollection of all reading matter, Mercedes never entered a V8 W116 in competitions, only the 280.

This may have something to do with the Gross Vehicle Mass and the ability to increase the power to weight ratio. All conversations on the subject would indicate that the fitment of ‘extractors’ or tuned length exhaust systems is an impossibility for the V8’s whereas the in-line 6 engine allowed for better tuning of inlet and exhaust tracts. This may be a reason behind the London to Sydney marathon vehicles being carburetted engines, allowing for triple Webbers [more air / fuel].

Overall the W116 was designed primarily as a saloon car, with luxury in mind. Perhaps a great deal of difficulty would be encountered attempting to lightweight the vehicle; albeit that the removal of seats, air-conditioning and sound deadening material might shave 300-400 kgs from the car!

There was the MERCEDES-BENZ 450 SLC 5.0 AMG MAMPE LUFTHNSA GROUP 4 One of three ever built. This car was built by AMG for Clemens Schickentanz and Hans Heyer for the ETCC and "24H Le Mans 1979". Unfortunately they DNF’ed at Le Mans. But won several races and podiums at European Touring Car Championship
 

oscar

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I think you've hit the nail on the head there once again BAR. Why would they bother with a heavy four door saloon when the same powerplants were put into lighter 2 door vehicles. I hope to achieve that 300-400kg weght loss. Will make such a difference.
 
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